i know what the rhetoric on the euro is, but i think it's just that. the central bankers would be overjoyed to see her (and the far right, overall) win an election.
t's really the oldest trick in the book in europe.
the economy goes down, blame the jews/gypsies/muslims/turks. that way, the angry masses attack them instead of the church/king/parliament/bank. from their perspective, that often solves two problems at once.
but europe also has a low population growth rate, which creates a systemic problem for capitalists that always seek conditions where the number of possible workers far exceeds the number of actually employed ones. there's a lot of very good reasons why that growth rate has stayed low and why europeans should seek to keep it low. however, the people of europe cannot have it both ways without abolishing capitalism - either they need to increase their growth rate, or they need to accept immigration, or they need to seize the means of production for themselves.
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IamMANnumber1
Germany has brought Europe to its knees 3 times in the last century.
deathtokoalas
"germany" has been in the process of conquering europe, in various levels of severity, for over two thousand years.
chocomalk
Wow do you people ever learn history? Most of Europe's historical woes are attributed elsewhere.
deathtokoalas
dude, it's just like when the visigoths invaded spain, it's just on a different level of abstraction.
chocomalk
Dude it's like saying Europe is not Norway, Sweden, England, France, the Netherlands, Austria etc...all descendants of Germanic tribes. It's like saying Western Germany is Eastern France or vice versa. You are looking at an orgy and finding a few parts you don't like without recognizing the attaching parts. Meanwhile the Romans, the Turks, , The Brits, The Russians, THE GREAT GAME, the(insert name)....
deathtokoalas
i'm not sure you can even make sense of that, so i'm not going to try to.
let's try again.
"germany" has been in the process of conquering europe, in various levels of severity, for over two thousand years.
now, think it through and understand the truth in it.
chocomalk
"Europe" is a relatively new concept, not one to be assigned 2000 years of existence. "Germany" was "Germania". the majority of what we call Europe today, the rest was Rome. So what is your point? That most of the original Germanic tribes that went on to become present day Europe because of a migration somehow tried to conquer itself? Technically the Visigoths would be attacking Rome not Europe. And technically Rome was the biggest aggressor. "Germania" was fairly consistent for about 1500 years regardless of it's name. The rest was Rome, or what was left of it after they fell and "other". The East is another matter. Anyway, you are still missing how everyone was trying to conquer everything..."everything" meaning what used to be Rome/Germania.
deathtokoalas
your understanding of history is a little bit confused, but it doesn't really matter because very little of what you're saying is in any way relevant (and the junkers that built the modern german state were actually not germans but prussians).
however,
1) europe is a geographic area and has existed as it does since roughly the end of the last ice age.
2) eastern europe was in fact largely built by east germans. as i feel you may be confused by a reference to the former soviet state, i need to separate between the east germans (who lived in modern day poland and ukraine and included groups like goths and lombards), the north germans (of scandinavia) and the west germans (of what we now call germany, france and england)
3) germans are not indigenous to the area we now call germany. rather, they moved south near the beginning of the historical period and conquered and displaced indigenous celts.
4) the continuum of tribes in europe were migratory and did not really respect national boundaries. at any given point, you would find not just germans in the area now known as germany but also celts, slavs, iranians and people from much further east, including huns and turkish-speaking people.
5) you'll note i put "germany" in quotes, which was to note that it did not exist as a nation-state 2500 years ago. however, the idea of a german nation united by language, religion and culture is not a new idea. our word for german comes from a greek association of odin with hermes. the germans were those who worshipped hermes. today, we think more in terms of linguistic groupings, of which i mentioned in (1).
6) my point is that "germany" has been in the process of conquering europe, in various levels of severity, for over two thousand years.
chocomalk
Prussian = Germanic, not sure where you are going with that lol.
1. Your vision of this "Europe" as a geological location does not take into account the artificial borders that exclude Russia/Asia etc. We are discussing pre civilized Europe during a time known as the great migration. A time when Europe did not exist as a set location and people came from all over. Sure, same rocks, but it's a whole lot bigger if you add all the stuff it is attached too without those convenient borders.
2. Germanic tribes, is there a point? And at what point are they not "Germanic" even though they hail from the same stock? You mention Goths as if they are not Germanic.
3. Yes they moved south as the Celts moved west, neither were "indigenous. And you quoted a 2000 year timeline, the Celts, what we know of them, predate that and were mainly affected by Rome. They were pushed, Germanic tribes were pushed, Slavic tribes were pushed... they all did pushing as well.
4. This is subject to a very long timeline, but it is pretty safe to say that regardless of who was ruling who, the lines have remained consistent for at least 1000 years give or take and were pretty much formed prior to that.
5. Funny we are communicating in German? No in English...why is that? Because there are other players in this you are not addressing. So the next language most likely for us to speak in would be German?...no it would be French. Although influenced by German, we consider many European languages to be "Latin" based. How could that be? You say this as if it is uniquely German.
6. Your point ignores everyone else, this makes you a bigot. In the same boat as Germany would be every tribe/culture you mention and some you have not. So is there a point? Besides being a bigot and pointing out one guilty party among many?
deathtokoalas
i don't feel you're following me, and i'm a little bored with your continued responses. i'm not seeking to build any sort of comparison or produce any kind of normative statements, i'm simply pointing out that "germany" has been in the process of conquering europe, in various levels of severity, for over two thousand years. and the prussians, now extinct, were balts.
chocomalk
No, I follow you, you are a bigot. And "Prussian" ≠ "Old Prussian".
deathtokoalas
now that i've blocked that idiot, i want to reiterate my point: that "germany" has been in the process of conquering europe, in various levels of severity, for over two thousand years.